I ask myself sometimes what's so distinctive about TD's 70s albums...is it really the use of electronics, or is it the fact that so much of it is improvised?
Do TD still improvise much? Do some of their later albums have that kinda improvised 'feel'? From hearing Electronic Journey, I would think 'no, not really'. True?
they improvise about as much as most bands would on stage (which makes me wonder why the hell people dog on TD so much these days...)
of course the 70's had more improv, but i guess what makes it so distinctive is they ALWAYS tried staying ahead of the curve in technology. and Berlin School music is pretty neat in general. i guess when things got digital (and then poppy, and then new age), they just didn't have their old appeal.
"I actually prefer RPGs and fantasise about massacring the morons at my school as Final Fantasy 7's Sephiroth. "
Well, I find that the later music (on Electronic Journey--it's all I know) DOES have a similar appeal to the older stuff in some ways. Maybe it's just the use of sequencers (listen to TD everyday and someone could become a sequencer addict), but I think it's the way the band play music over sequencer patterns which is really quite different to how any other 'electronic bands' do it. (unfortunately from what I've heard of Schulze, he doesn't seem to play anything on top of the sequencer lines. Makes his music sound like TD demos!)
The later music is more straightforwardly melodic--and there's nothing wrong with melody--but ... maybe the difference is the use of conventional drum tracks on top of the rest of what the band is doing?
On the early records, there's no drums and my ears tell me there's no need for drums (a bass sequencer line along with the melodic trebly sequencer can give the music all the rhythmic pulse that might suit).
On some late TD recordings I've heard, my ears tell me: 'this could still work, or, in some cases, actually work much better without the drums' because there's enough music there to hold it together. Not always, but on the best tracks.....yes.
When you put a rock or techno beat in there, I think it becomes the centre of gravity in the music to a listener and for instrumental music that can make the music sound more bland. TD don't 'need' drums. 'Ricochet' sounds like drums were programmed to create an improvised, jazz-drumming type of sound, but...again, even that (and Ricochet pt.1 is my favourite) sounds like the drums are a bit of an 'intrusion' or cluttering up the music, somehow. (although I do like 'order of the ginger guild'!)
I'm waffling no doubt, but I find it fascinating that TD are like a 'rock band' that isn't actually a 'rock band'. They seem to be closer, artistically, to the sort of world-fusion artists who just create eclectic instrumental music after their own hearts except none of those artists actually use sequencers/synths etc. to a significant degree. The programmed drums, or playing tunes off the programmed drum beats, sound like they can 'limit' how far TD go in that direction (at least in my imagination). Also, the inclusions of metal-style guitar solos that we've all heard a 1000 bands do before or very obvious chord sequences. On the 70s albums, there's flute solos (a bit like sax solos now) and there's guitar parts but those parts sound like an addition to the tune, as is, rather than something imitating a familiar-to-everybody-sound....
Actually TD's recent sound, a bit like Jan Hammer's sound for Miami Vice and his Miramar albums in the early 90s, sounds like it has been heavily influenced by years of doing US tv and film music. I mean, it's still good music (in the sense of well written and/or tuneful--that's a real skill in itself) but it can sound like it's been written almost for background music to a tv program or film (or something to fit some such glossy images) rather than something completely for the imagination of the listener. I mean, when I hear the 70s albums, there's no possible 'ready made image or idea' that the music is ever going to conjure up. It is totally itself. Nothing else. It's Art. Great. But when I hear Electronic Journey, the music often conjures up thoughts like 'this sounds like tv music for a documentary about the grand canyon, or space travel, or a soap opera love scene, or an action scene, or an advertisement for a sports car'. That might sound like it's demeaning the music --I don't mean to do that--but it reflects a limit to how much the music reaches some kind of an artistic antenna in my head. I probably sound like I'm on drugs now, but hey...opinions are opinions. Everyone has one, amongst other things...
owen wrote:I ask myself sometimes what's so distinctive about TD's 70s albums...is it really the use of electronics, or is it the fact that so much of it is improvised?
Both. I would say that TD's days of true improvisation (on studio albums, not live or soundtrack albums) ended as early as 1975. From 'Stratosfear' onwards, the compositions became increasingly composed and more tightly structured, though pieces like 'Madrigal Meridian', 'Thru Metamorphic Rocks' and particularly some of Edgar's contributions into the 80's (e.g. 'Convention of the 24') maintained improvisation.
owen wrote:I ask myself sometimes what's so distinctive about TD's 70s albums...is it really the use of electronics, or is it the fact that so much of it is improvised?
Do TD still improvise much? Do some of their later albums have that kinda improvised 'feel'? From hearing Electronic Journey, I would think 'no, not really'. True?
I think they improvised a lot more in the old days, than they do now, and all th elive albums and bootlegs showed that ... it also suggested that recreating the sounds was not exactly that easy at all, and things got easier and better as time went by.
Today ... I can't say ... I think there is a spot where things can be improvised for an X amount of time and then this theme crawls in and we're back in sync ... but to be honest with you ... I want to see a show where TD does not play anything that we know, and they have the total freedom to do and go anywhere they choose with the instruments, and I want to throw the first wrench by walking into their stations turning 10 knobs and they are set to go!
But rock fans are fickle jerks ... they want hits ... and to re-live their old days ... instead of living brand new experiences ...
I just wish I was a rich fart ... because TD would play in my living room, and I would tell them ... no songs, no routines ... just free flow it all ... anywhere you want ... I just want to live through it all --- that simple!
